Scaling Smart: A Balanced Approach to Velocity and Door Count | Mehek Khera, Niramaya Foods

tSpeaker 1: 00:00
Welcome to Shelf Help. Today we're speaking with Mahek Kara, who is the founder and CEO of Neiramaya Foods, who's joining us from NYC. Nearmaya Foods is an Indian-inspired brand that's really on a mission to make delicious, nutritious, home-style Indian dishes just more accessible to the masses. I've always been a big fan of India-inspired food, so definitely excited to get into it. First off, for the listeners, Mehek, that aren't that familiar with Niramaya, maybe just give us a quick lay of the land in terms of origin story, why behind the brand, what products you offer, and then maybe just throw out a few places that people can get their hands on them, and then we'll go from there.

Speaker: 00:42
Absolutely. Thank you so much for having me on the podcast, Adam. I really appreciate it. So hello everyone. I'm Mehek. I'm the founder of Naramaia Foods, and we are an Indian American snack food brand. So we launched with a line of dips, which are versatile, go from snacking to mealtime. You can use them as marinades, cooking sauces, or even just eat them straight out of the jar like I do. And we recently launched a line of non-bradzils, which is a hybrid snack between a non and a Bradzel. Delicious, crunchy, grain-free, allergen-free bites. And you can find all of our products and sprouts nationwide. And you know, they are proudly placed in the Asian set. So uh I would love if y'all would go and support us there. But a little bit about the origin story uh is that I grew up in India and I was 24 years old when I moved here. My great-grandmother, my Pardadi, she lived 120 years old. And not just that, she was also an entrepreneur. So I'm following in her footsteps. She used to sell indigo, which is a plant, um, the color uh, you know, that was so popular during the British Raj in India. And she used to do commerce on horses, swimming rivers, just the epitome of entrepreneurship right there. So all these recipes and the nutrition that are inherently a part of Indian cooking were passed down through her. And I decided to use that wisdom, that knowledge of heritage-inspired nutrition to bring products to the American consumer that was not just Indian, but Indian in a way that were accessible to them in form factors that they could understand, love, and use again and again. But we provided this exceptional, unparalleled experience through flavor and attributes that would make them just the premium choice on shelf. Um, and of course, that was due to my own health journey as well. Um became a host of, you know, some autoimmune disorders back when I was working for Walmart. And uh I decided to do a nutrition degree at that time. And that's when the dots actually connected for me were that what I grew up eating was so nutritious that I never really stopped to realize that because it was so delicious, and it was also readily cooked and available for me through my parents. So that was what I was missing, and there was a huge blank space on the shelf. And that's why why Narmaya was born. Nuremaya means wellness for all, and that's the mission and vision we built this company around.

Speaker 1: 03:16
Oh, that's an amazing journey, amazing story. Thanks so much for sharing.

Speaker: 03:19
Absolutely.

Speaker 1: 03:21
Well, yeah, let's rewinding back to some of those really early days, to those initial RD formulation days. I think from from what I know, just doing the research that I did, it was quite a journey, which is not uncommon. I think you did over 200 trials over a multi-year period, really just to get not only the flavor, but I think the mouthfeel and shelf stability right as well. I'm kind of curious, what were some of those key variables that you played around with over those two two years or so? And did was there eventually some type of aha moment where all of a sudden it felt like this definitely worked, or was it kind of just a really slow, you know, step-by-step process every time you made something, it just got a little bit better until you finally felt like, okay, this is this is good?

Speaker: 04:05
That's just such a great question. So when I started ideating this company, Adam, in 2020, it was the peak of COVID, and everybody was quarantined for the most part, and you know, we were all cooking at home much more than we ever cooked. So, same for me. I was at home cooped up with my husband, and I was trying to make our foods more nutritious, so you know, you we could build up immunity, we could eat fresh and healthy at home. So whilst doing that, I started revisiting these recipes that my family makes consistently at home and decided to boost them with like herbs and plants even more so that, you know, maybe turmeric could add some of its benefits, black pepper, caraway seeds, cumin, all of that. But it was a long journey and I didn't realize it would be so long to take those recipes from my kitchen top to a shelf-stable, ready-to-scale, commercialized product, ready for retail stores. Of course, there are paths where you know folks explore commercial kitchens, smaller ways to produce their product. And we did that for a while, but it didn't work out for us because the product was a complicated batch. We needed to achieve a certain level of acidity, a certain level of temperatures, which was so difficult to manage and uh keep up with every time on the line that it was quickly becoming a business of its own. And I needed to go out there and sell and market the product. So I decided to stay clear from self-manufacturing. That was not my strength. And that's where the real struggle kind of started. I started to call, you know, my local manufacturers that I found through, you know, whatever yellow pages I found at that time. And I remember funnily enough, the first person I called used to bottle waters. You know, they had a, you know, a bottling line, and I was like, Can you please make the sauces for me? They were like, No, you know, we we just bottle waters and that's about it. And it was so hard for me to understand the nuances of the food industry because I came from retail and fashion, which was very different from food. And so, really understanding that every product is built different, the scalability really depends upon already existing infrastructures that you must go and find. And so that's when the ideation kind of became more nuanced and iterative, where every decision was either built to scale or built to bring a product that was exceptional and nothing like that existed. So, like one of the first decisions that we took that we would be using real vegetables in the dips. We would not just make it an oil and spice paste. Because people have enough of that, right? Uh, they already get a lot of oils and spices anyway. So we would make these more wholesome, and that's where the positioning kind of naturally shifted from sauces to dips because they were so wholesome and they were not just oil and spice pastes. So layer by layer, I think the identity of the brand and the identity of the product kind of solidified over the next two years as we found our first contract manufacturing partner. And once we found them, we brought these recipes to them, and then it again took six months from there to be able to align and agree on a flavor profile, mouth feel, aftertaste, salsibility to get all the certifications that we needed to, you know, really communicate to the consumer that we really are who we say we are. Like, for example, if we buy non-GMO products, then we do have a certification to go along with it. Similar with whole 30, similar with all these different attributes like vegan, dairy-free, gluten-free, you know, testing uh took time, QA took time. And so it was really learning all these processes that are pretty much needed for food products to sustain and be well in the marketplace. And then another thing that I learned through the process was once you do get into distribution, even regional or national, it's very difficult to make any kind of changes to your pack size, to your quantity, to your labels. So it's better to do all that research upfront and test and try. And we did a lot of that at pop-up markets, events, and many other spaces before we actually launched a commercialized product in our first retail store.

Speaker 1: 08:21
That's a great overview. You do touch on it really briefly, but I think one of the things you really pride the brand on is not using any preservatives. So I'm curious what was what was the key to actually achieving that shelf stability that you were looking for, which I know you did, but what was the key to getting there?

Speaker: 08:41
Yeah, absolutely. So a lot of condiments use a process, Adam, which is called a hotfill process, which leads the product to becoming shell-stable. So what they do is they acidify the product at a certain temperature so that it's aseptic and then it's sealed. But the challenge that becomes with doing that is often these sauces and these products can be very sour tasting because of the acid. So a big challenge was to manage the sourness as a taste offering versus the shelf stability for us. And so that's how we made it shelf stable is by using lemon juice, which is a natural preservative, and also a natural acidifier. And so all natural products, no high sodium contents or no preservatives that we added on top of that.

Speaker 1: 09:29
That's great. Yeah, lemon juice makes sense. Makes a lot of sense. I think you touched on this piece a little bit too, but when I was doing my research on the brand, and I know one thing you really use to really differentiate the formulation as you know, via flavor, color, having a really nutrient-dense product is that you really focus on sourcing fresh produce that goes pretty quickly to your copacker. So obviously, I assume though that produce is being sourced from that's a very close proximity to those copackers. And you touch on the copackers a bit, but I'm just kind of curious as you continue to expand, let's just say I'm not sure your copacker is now, I think I think it might be on the West Coast, but let's just say uh you get to a certain volume in another region where you need to diversify and expand to another copacker, or maybe you outgrow the current one and they're not located where a lot of the fresh produce you've been sourcing. Are you starting to think about that? What that's gonna look like as you continue to scale, or do you already kind of have a plan for that? Are you not worried about that?

Speaker: 10:26
That's such a great question. So, yes, we do uh source from near where we produce, Adam. And so keeping our supply chain short was always important because there's a value to building a shorter ecosystem of microbials and these vegetables and all of that good stuff that goes into eating fresh, local, seasonal, all of that. Our co-packer is built to scale. So they are a nationally distributed co-packing facility. They co-pack for very big brands. A lot of the times when we source from farmers, let's say in California, these are big, big farms and these are big farmers, and often these vegetables are sold as IQF, meaning that they're chopped up or sliced and froze frozen, you know, so that they can make it to the co-manufacturing facility in the same state that they were frozen at. So it the freezing process actually stops their aging and keeps them fresh whilst having a short supply chain. So that's I think our magic pantra to scaling up as far as nationally distribution of our dips. We are currently nationally distributed. So we only have one manufacturing site, and they're pretty much able to continue to build up that load and scale along with us through buying fresh and local.

Speaker 1: 11:41
That's great. You touched on the the co-packers a bit. I think I read that you rather actually built a list or actually reached out to 500 or so co-packers, which is super impressive. I know you know there aren't too many databases, they're not the easiest to find. I'm curious, it might have just been a matter of just finding the right fit one, but if not, did your kind of cold call script to call in these co-packers and get them excited about the brand and give you the time of day? How did that script evolve over time and what did you eventually get really resonated with these prospective co-packer partners?

Speaker: 12:14
100%. So I particularly had a very tedious journey finding the right co-manufacturing partner. And that's one of the biggest roadblocks in any entrepreneur's journey is the question between self-manufacturing versus, you know, doing the MOQs that many of these. So I would like to mention that many of these people that I were calling might not were just food manufacturers. I had no idea to tell whether they made dips or sauces or chips or whatnot. So a lot of these first hits or first calls were just out of Google searches, out of references, out of finding people at networking events and all of that. So that's why it was a lot of misses more than a lot of hits. But then I found my current co-packet through actually an introduction from another entrepreneur who made a similar product. And that's how I I was able to kneel down and build trust and confidence through their high referral for that partner.

Speaker 1: 13:10
That's great. What did when you found that one that was a good fit? Did it were they pretty excited about the concept from the get-go? And if they were great, if not, and it took a bit more convincing to you know get them on board with an upstart brand. Probably the first, you know, if your production run, the volume's gonna be lower. What was that like in terms of kind of convincing that that Copac you're Yeah, that's a great question too.

Speaker: 13:31
So it's it was a multifaceted conversation with them, Adam. So the first time I spoke with them, they were definitely buying into the idea. They were very excited, they loved the founder journey and story. But at the same time, they are built to scale. And so it's very hard for them to support a young entrepreneur with small MOQs. But they were flexible enough to do a lot of test patches for us. So we were able to utilize their test kitchen to do a lot of kitchen top testing, which was actually very close to uh, you know, their production facility. So it was better than testing at in my own kitchen at home without the supplier samples and without the different measurement techniques to actually see the acid levels or the temperatures. So they were flexible there. But when it came to MOQs, they were not flexible. And I do kind of understand why, because their line needs a certain kind of volume to be able to run and make sense of the unit economics and their labor time. So I had to pause for a while, save money, and then go back to uh a truly bootstrapped approach. So I saved money through whatever I had from my job and investments and all of that. And so it took that initial amount, which I invested into achieving their MOQs. And once they had the product in hand, I think the product even convinced them even more that nothing like this exists in the marketplace. Your differentiation is huge and the product quality is huge. They uh were huge believers in the brand since then, and we've scaled up, you know, thoughtfully and slowly because of that belief and partnership through them. So, yes, I think it was a step-by-step approach to convincing them that yes, this is something that I'm truly invested in and the market also truly needs.

Speaker 1: 15:19
Yeah, that makes that makes a lot of sense. At some point, you went through a process of removing oils. At what point did you go through that reformulation? And then, you know, for other brand owners that are maybe considering a similar change to create a cleaner product, for them just thinking ahead for them, giving them a bit of a bit of a head start, what are gonna be some of the biggest challenges we're gonna come up against as they try to go forward and make that pretty significant change?

Speaker: 15:46
Yeah, so when we started out, Adam, our dips had cashews and they also had olive oil. So we all always had good oils in our product, and oils are not bad whatsoever. They are a very integral and essential part of any cooking around the world. It was a very personal and thoughtful decision on our end because at the time that we made this call, we had just received an opportunity to do an innovation aisle at Sprouts where it was a three-month in-and-out program for three of our SKUs of our dips. And I personally went from state to state demoing our product to Sprouts consumers to meet them face to face. It was the first time we were in a big retail store and it was our first product, and I was a new entrepreneur. I had a story to share. So it uh going through that exercise, although I do understand that might not have been scalable, but I heard firsthand from the consumers that uh, you know, somebody is going through diabetes diabetes or sugar, you know, sugar and different types of uh sugar intolerances or digestive issues or you know, certain kinds of dietary requirements where they want a flavor bomb. They want a flavor bomb that has clean ingredients, but that they can mix with protein or they can mix with the grain of their choice or grain-free snack of their choice for the matter. And everybody kind of said that we we would eat this dip in a sitting. So what if it had no oils in it? Because we were eating so much of it, they were not really cooking with it. They were like, I'm eating it with carrots and I'm eating it with veggies or just dipping bread into it. So I really heard that feedback and I thought that they have cashews already, so they have natural fats. And so we may be okay in the cooking process if we did remove the oils. And so we tried it and it worked. And we then tested it back with our consumers. The formulation was a little bit thinner than before, but that actually helped make it a little bit more malleable for cooking. So for people that were cooking with the dips, they had a more malleable formulation, and the people that were dipping had no oil, so it was a win-win for both, and that's how we actually took that decision was very consumer-led.

Speaker 1: 17:58
Yeah, that totally makes sense. So totally shifting gear. So just thinking back similar to those early days, as you were probably at the same time in a parallel path working on the formulation, you're probably also working on building at least kind of the the V1 that you're gonna bring to market of the brand identity, visual identity, packaging design. Thinking back to those early days, what were some of those key variables that were top of mind for you? Uh and maybe another way to look at it is what were some of the key things that you remember that were included in that brief with whomever you worked with, a designer, freelance or agency or whatnot?

Speaker: 18:34
Sure. So we worked with an agency called DRON. Uh, they're based out of Eugene, Oregon, and uh their founder became our early advisor and mentor through the process. So a lot of these decisions were back and forth discussions with him and seeking his guidance and experience in the CPG industry to be able to ask the right questions and find answers. But some of the things that came out were I didn't find an Indian brand on the shelf that I could relate with as a millennial and as a first-generation immigrant that uh, you know, had traveled from India but now living this life here. So I was honestly neither an Indian nor an American and an Indian and an American at the same time. It was a very weird state to be. And that's the exact junction that we built this brand around. So a lot of the discussions were around that Indian-American decision making, what feels authentic and what feels accessible. And then some of these decisions were also around hierarchy of call-outs because we had so much good stuff in our product and there was not enough space to actually, but that's where their expertise kind of comes in, package design that we heavily relied on. Some of the other discussions were around the ingredients that we were choosing and how they were resonating with the consumers and appropriate call-outs for them, like super greens was the term being used uh in salads to describe. And since we were using a lot of spinach in the spinach dip, it feeled fitting to use that terminology or an Indian street food dip that we have, which is now called the sweet bhaji. It's uh it's practically a dish made on you know street carts all throughout India, served as an Indian sloppy joe kind of a situation. So, how to best represent that dish to the American consumer who's only ever tried butter chicken, right?

Speaker 1: 20:23
That's great. That's really helpful. And has the since launch up until now, has the core messaging as well as the look and feel of the brand packaging remained pretty consistent, or have there been any big changes or what you might call rebrands since that launch?

Speaker: 20:40
So we've not had any rebrands, and that's all for the better because the two years that we were actually searching for the core manufacturing partner, we were working behind the scenes on the branding. And so a lot of the changes and the you know updates that happened were during that time, even before we launched the brand. So we got a lot of like ways to try different techniques and different uh kinds of theories with that branding approach. Apart from like minor changes on the packaging label Adam, I don't think we've changed much. It's remained pretty consistent, which I'm so happy about.

Speaker 1: 21:15
Yeah, that's great. I mean, it sounds like you did a lot of the really good work up front to really make sure what you had was gonna be pretty long standing. You went with a a uh the glass jar packaging form factor. What was that kind of thought process that led to the glass jar form factor?

Speaker: 21:30
So it was a process of elimination for us. And so what that meant was we knew that this is the product that we are trying to bring bring to the market. It's more wholesome than sauces, so it's better suited as a dip and it's thicker, it's more satiable. I stayed away from the refrigerated section coming from supply chain. I knew the costs, and you know, I was prepared to fight different battles in the CPG industry, not the freight ones. And so we steered clear from the refriger refrigerated aisle and planned to conquer the. Center store, the grocery section. So that's where the shelf stability kind of kicked in. And once that happened, we were seeing brands like Primal Kitchen and CAT Foods and, you know, all these different brands do amazing work when it came to dips. And there were no brands in the Indian-inspired flavor section actually considering dips are that form factor, whereas snacking is a global melting pot. You know, it welcomes flavors from all around the world. And so we decided to be pioneers in that movement and select a similar form factor with these authentic recipes, these flavors that were never shared before, could highlight the home style, street style Indian cooking, whilst also giving the American consumers a form factor they already know and enjoy, reducing friction.

Speaker 1: 22:47
Talking about growth and go to market for a second. Well, I talked to a lot of operators and as well as investors, and they all have generally seem to be on a similar track. You know, you should focus on velocity, growing too fast can be the kiss of death. But I feel like I've heard you talk about how if you do things in the right way, scaling faster can potentially actually help from a cash flow perspective. I'm curious what's yeah, what does this look like? And how have you found a bit of a different approach has worked really well for you?

Speaker: 23:17
Yeah, so definitely there's always chatter in the industry about you know going uh mile-wide inch deep versus one or the other. For us, I completely see the merits of that philosophy, and velocities are really important. Without that, you're just buying shelf space. You're not actually selling your product to consumers, right? But I think now, knowing what I know today, Adam, I would say that for any new entrepreneur who's willing to put a strategy in place, should really look at the category that they are selling into and really talk to the buyer about what the expected velocities of that category are, because the velocities of sauces versus dips versus snacks versus sweets are completely different. So whether it's two units per week per store or 20, you should know what you what you're up against. And if you're hitting that velocity and if you're able to form that wheel of marketing and trade spend and sales that's churning, then I see no reason why you can't increase your distribution footprint. So it's both. You can't just have velocity or have distribution or have distribution and no velocity. I think at some point distribution makes a lot of sense for you to scale and make sense. What you might have heard is that we are a very bootstrapped and debt financed brand. So what that means is when we get a big PO, which usually happens through a national order, we are able to make enough gross profit that fuels our marketing efforts. So it actually helps. Distribution kind of helps velocity, which is a very crude way of putting it. But it's what it is. It's hard to find capital in the industry and it's um hard to keep ownership of the company while finding the right partner that can help us scale. And till that time, I think having these POs has really helped us get debt, uh safe debt, which we can turn around quickly to actually aid into velocities and aid into more distribution, which wouldn't have happened if I were just selling to 10 stores.

Speaker 1: 25:11
It's really cool to hear that just because it's it's a pretty contrary contrarian approach.

Speaker: 25:15
Yeah, but I will also mention as a side note is that we had really strong branding to begin with, and we had tested out our products in pop-up events and other places to get that initial feedback, just to be really clear, because sometimes that can be a hidden information or a hidden knowledge for entrepreneurs, is that really test and try someplace before you do scale and have enough monies to do that.

Speaker 1: 25:38
Totally. I know you're based in NYC. What have you found, or kind of what did you find, or have you found, or some of the pros and cons of launching in New York City?

Speaker: 25:46
Yeah, no, that makes sense. So it's interesting that when I was launching this brand, Adam, I was simultaneously moving to the city. So I was really excited about the, you know, the the prospects of selling into independence to selling into bodegas and to really testing and trying the market. We had held out for a while to sell in this region in the grocery stores due to a potential exclusivity with the retailer that we were in talks with at that time. So whilst we were holding out this region as an exclusive region for that retailer, we actually got opportunities to launch in Mom's organic markets, which is not in the city, but like New Jersey and Virginia and Philadelphia and all of that. So we launched there instead. We launched in some of the high-V stores, we launched in downtow, like all these different kinds of natural independent markets to test and learn. But now with our pretzels, we are quickly growing in the city. So we are in uh West Side uh marketplaces, we are in a happier grocery, which is like the Air One of New York, or New Air One is the happier of LA, whatever, like being politically correct here. Um and more to come. Uh, but we didn't become a New York dance in the first two years of our launch. Then we quickly expanded out, did some tests with sprouts. We are also in Albertson stores with our depths nationwide. That happened, and um, you know, safe way stores, once pavilions. We were really in a prime location in the Indo-Hispanic such. So those are of our key retailers starting out.

Speaker 1: 27:23
That's awesome. Expanding beyond just New York City in general, thinking about sprouts that you're in and some of the other key retailers that you're selling into that you just mentioned. What are getting really kind of in the weeds? What are some of the core tools, tactics you found that have the most impact of actually driving velocity?

Speaker: 27:40
Yeah. Uh I think it's a culmination of so many factors, Adam, when it comes to velocities and depends on the store a lot, too, like how you're some stores allow demos, some don't, some allow shippers, some don't, some have case tag deals, some don't. So I think it's about really partnering with the buyer at that store to understand what moves the needle for them and what they would like to see the brand doing to support the you know products on the shelf. Promotions are a great way to do that, but of course, promotions should be very strategic too, to actually understand what's your lift, what's your metric, how long-term benefit those promos bring. Execution of those promos is a second thing because uh, you know, if you're dealing with natural distribution and promos, it's very hard to manage uh shelf tags and you know the eyes and ears on the shelf to see where it's going live and where it's not. So that's where you know field teams or merchandisers come into play. Social media is a big avenue. I feel like even now, it might not have like a next day impact, but it has a longer-term brand awareness, which leads to people finding your product. And then, of course, uh, you know, promotions again, it's a numbers game. So really turning through that, gaining a visibility on the shelf, optimizing your location, maybe even discussing secondary placements where possible, all go a long way in kind of increasing your velocities over time and also having a great product because people won't buy your product if they don't like it.

Speaker 1: 29:15
Totally.

Speaker: 29:16
And so continuously like hearing feedback from your consumers to see how you are positioned compared to your competition and you know what people are saying, what they are buying, what their inhibitions may be, all of that kind of it's a long-term kind of play.

Speaker 1: 29:31
You mentioned in at least in Sprouts, you've got travel around the country doing a bunch of demos and a bunch of locations. Sounds like you've done a fair amount of that. What is a it's kind of a broad question, but what is a successful demo looked like in your mind?

Speaker: 29:44
Yeah. So, you know, demos can vary a lot because it depends on the store traffic at that time that you're doing the demo. It depends on, you know, how enthusiastic and pumped up the demo person is, how well lit and presented their setup is. That all kind of matters because if you think about it, these are real people in the stores who are going about their day and some are in a rush, and some are with their kids, and some are just doing grocery shop. So not everybody might be your consumer. So one of the very real learnings from the demo floor is that you'll meet all if you're a founder doing demo, you'll meet all kinds of people. And so having a thick skin is really important. But what kind of works in terms of a demo strategy is that if you can sell out the shelf in like three hours, because they have six to twelve samples on the that's usually a good indicator. If people are trying on the spot and they're giving you positive reviews and qualitative feedback, that's a good sign. If they're bringing their friends and family to try it too, that's a great sign. If you get a lot of people to follow you on social media after they tried the product and they're willing to become advocates, that's a good sign. But usually sales, like the expectation there is that they they have tried it, they've bought it once, and now they will become repeat consumers as a result of that investment. It's a long-term ROI kind of a thing, but for the shorter term, it's like if you can sell out the store stock.

Speaker 1: 31:06
What have you found is the best way to maintain velocity momentum after that kind of initial excitement of a launch, whether you did a demo blitz or yeah, maybe you got an end cap placement. The one thing is kind of go back to normal.

Speaker: 31:20
Yeah, so what I've learned is that, and I'm still learning, Adam, is that different retailers have different ways they market. So some places may have coupons printed, some places may have digital coupons, and they have different names for these, and they have uh different programs, they have different ways to execute the same promotion, like a BOGO means, you know, one place might be executed differently versus the other place. So, really getting to know what the retailer-specific marketing plans are, and often the teams at the retailers they share it out uh every time they update that material. So, really walking through that material and comparing it to your budget and seeing where the best ROI for you is, where whether you're aiming brand awareness or whether you're aiming you know immediate trial, whatever that means. And then I think partnering with the buyer on that and seeking their recommendation too, if they are willing to share that and execute that, invest in marketing, and see what the ROI is and then shift. It's a lot of trial and error if you're a young brand, at least for me it is. And that's what I'm learning. It's very nuanced. Like what works for Whole Foods Market is not the same thing that works for Sprouts. I mean, it might be similar, but it's executed very differently.

Speaker 1: 32:35
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. That's definitely what I've heard. Age retailer is pretty different in a lot of ways.

Speaker: 32:40
I was briefly in a buying position at my previous employer. And so in that position, uh, I knew that, you know, when people in those positions of making decisions receive a ton of emails, they try to prioritize for what their goals are, whilst also making sure that they get back to everyone. But sometimes it might just not be possible. And, you know, in the food world, there's so many food brands. It's such the number of brands is so high that it might be physically impossible for the buyer to get back to everyone if they're a national buyer or whatnot. But yes, having empathy uh, you know, also means over time trying to understand what the metrics that the buyer is looking for are. Because we are so focused on what we are trying to sell. And often those pitches look like I have a vegan gluten-free, blah, blah, blah, product, we are the best in the market. And that's all great. But there are so many brands like that. It's very competitive. It's very seldom that a brand is brand is so differentiated that there's nothing like that on the shelf, right? So buyers are looking at very similar pitches all the time. And so it's really important to understand what the buyers' KPIs are. What are they really looking to achieve in the category? Are they looking to achieve incremental sales or new consumers coming to their set, or you know, a commodity like offering that sells a lot of units? Like, what is your positioning? And it's hard to actually find out what those criteria are. But after a while, like startup CPG has so many events where you can meet buyers face to face. And there are grocery runs happening these days. There are like trade shows where buyers are becoming more and more accessible, pitch slams. So, you know, hearsay, all of that kind of tells an entrepreneur, okay, this is the need of the buyer and not the market. I'm probably serving the need of the market, but what's the need of the buyer? So that's where the empathy comes from. And once you find that out and tailor your pitch to that, and it's a pretty easy process after that.

Speaker 1: 34:40
Yeah, that's a really good, that's a really good suggestion. Is one of your goals to avoid being siloed in that ethnic specialty and really instead look to become a go-to flavor and the center store? What does that look like in terms of when you're having conversations with with buyers?

Speaker: 34:57
Right. It's been an ongoing discussion and debate in the last five to six years, I feel like, and more so because there wasn't a need for this debate before, because either a brand was so ethnic or a brand was completely mainstream before. But now, because of these hyphen brands that are getting created and all these snacking brands that are getting created that are global flavor-based, the question comes up. And we face that dilemma too, Adam. I would say that it's very product dependent and it's very retail dependent. So some stores might have a healthy living section, so it might completely eradicate the need of being ethnic or snack. You might be in a completely different part of the store, which is basically gluten-free or vegan or whatnot. But if your product is well suited in form factor and main hierarchy in one or the other sets, then that's pretty much where it will stay for a long period of time. For us as a brand, we core mantra is disruption. So whether we are placed in the ethnic set, if that remains our reality, then we plan to really rule that space with so many different categories. Like we are the first brand that provides snacks in the Indian set at sprouts. There weren't any snacks before that in that set. And so that's a start. Now there's the possibility of moving that to the snacking set, which we are getting placed in other stores. But if that doesn't happen, then the succession for that product will also land in the ethnic set, really disrupting that space, changing shelf heights and you know, changing what people expect from that shelf. Um for us, it's disruption is the key, but for a generic answer, it's dependent really dependent upon the product and the grocery store you're looking at.

Speaker 1: 36:39
I might be making an assumption here, but I know you just launched this new product line, the non-pretzels.

Speaker: 36:45
Yes.

Speaker 1: 36:46
Was part of what we just talked about part of the thought process of launching this product line?

Speaker: 36:50
Our consumers always asked us about a partner product for the dips, Adam. And just as a wholesome experience to for our consumers, I always think about them as guests in my home. So if somebody was coming to my home, I would just not give them the dips, and that's it. I would make something else for them. And so I made something else for the guests, quote unquote, which is consumers in this case. Why pretzels? Because I felt like from a creative angle, the non bread, which is an Indian flatbread, is very gluten gluten-filled and it's very uh indulgent and it's very delicious. And similarly, pretzels here, living in New York, I have access to a lot of hot, fresh pretzels, right? And so looking at them, smelling them every time on my walk, I could feel the similarities between the two types of bread. One was so popular in India and becoming so popular in and then pretzel is already a favorite uh confector uh, you know, here in the US. So combining those two felt like a natural creative call. You know, those two belong together when it came to Indian American snacking. But then from a business perspective, the pretzel category in general is a huge category, but also is a very boring category. So we were able to pierce through that with a lot of attributes and flavors and colors that hadn't been done before, which gave us a huge competitive advantage. So that's why that decision was taken.

Speaker 1: 38:19
Shifting gears a little bit, and I I'm pretty sure you won this um this thing called the Walmart Golden Ticket. What is this? And I'm curious, like what do you feel like you did better or or differently that that gave you the best chance that actually led you to win?

Speaker: 38:35
So, first of all, working at Walmart was such a like I grew in that company straight out of college from different entry-level positions to then uh having so it was close to my heart and you know it was a full circle moment when I saw that there was an open call invitation on Range Me, I just wanted to apply, not knowing what would come next. And when I was sitting with that buyer in the room pitching my product, I was really pitching from my heart and really positioning my products into why the consumer of today needs those in the marketplace. And that's about it. I had zero expectations from that meeting, and you know, I was just in awe of what Walmart is, and you know, for the possibility of the products being in the shelves one day. And we're far from, I mean, even though we have a golden ticket as a company, we are still growing to one day kind of launching our products on Walmart shelves. But uh the belief and the you know, thumbs up from the buyer really meant a lot to us and what our products could be in the marketplace. And so it was a very surreal experience, Adam.

Speaker 1: 39:40
I can imagine. Man, that's really cool. Definitely a full sarcum moment to say the least. What does your daily dashboard look like? Meaning you wake up in the morning, core data points that you're kind of looking at every morning to kind of track where things are and making sure you're keeping eye and keeping an eye on the business.

Speaker: 39:55
First thing is cash flow, always cash going in, cash going out. How long can I survive? What are my sales plans? That's always like to keep my company alive and well. Second thing is inventory, any urgent priorities, add a um again, being a solo entrepreneur is a blessing and a curse at the same time because one, you don't have to manage people at this stage, but two, every single request comes to me. And so I it can quickly become a and I'm glad to have like fractional people and partners and you know, all that is great. But so there's a lot of like urgent needs and ad hoc requests that come my way, and then I do look at inventory levels within our distributors. That's very pertinent to look at you know any inventory going bad or near shelf life and all of that. Any new submissions that the sales take a lot of my time, and then, you know, of course, finance, you know, budgeting and you know, making sure my books are closed at the end of every month and marketing and social media, podcasts, and all of that. So it's different every day, but it's everything most of the days.

Speaker 1: 40:59
That's totally fair as a solar entrepreneur. Totally respect that. Last question for you. Uh yeah, any and just any brands or broader trends in the CPG space in general that have been getting you excited about lately, things you've been keeping your eye on, maybe outside your category or within your category.

Speaker: 41:14
Yeah, so definitely within our category global flavors is I see a lot of different startups coming into this space. And no doubt it's very exciting. Other categories, I feel like Seven Sundays is my favorite brand. Recently, I have never seen myself buy so much of one thing, but um I love that brand. And Blue Zones Kitchen is another brand that I absolutely love. Dan Boetner's book, Blue Zones Kitchen, was something that led me through my own health struggles, and now seeing products that is really surreal. So kudos to to them. But these are the two that I really love.

Speaker 1: 41:48
I both love those too. Well, yeah, Mac, what's the um what's the best place for people to follow along with with you personally and also best place for people to follow along with the brand these days as well.

Speaker: 42:00
Yeah, I post a lot on LinkedIn, probably more than I should. And it's like my professional diary. So I try to keep it real there. So that's the best way to follow me, or Nara Mea's page on TikTok and Instagram is where I'm starting to share my journey as well.

Speaker 1: 42:15
Perfect. We'll definitely share those in the notes. Yeah, Megan, it's been great. Really appreciate the time. Super informative. And um, yeah, good luck in the brand.

Speaker: 42:22
Thank you so much for having me, Adam. I really appreciate the opportunity and have a great rest of your day. Thanks.

Speaker 1: 42:28
Awesome, likewise.

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